bugFree UCS Outline Fonts - Bugs: bug #49359, ۇ looks incrrect in Uyghur

 
 

bug #49359: ۇ looks incrrect in Uyghur

Submitted by:  Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Submitted on:  Sun 16 Oct 2016 04:20:30 PM UTC  
 
Category: individual character(s)Severity: 3 - Normal
Item Group: character substitution issueStatus: Need info
Privacy: PublicAssigned to: Steve White <Stevan_White>
Open/Closed: OpenRelease: development

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Mon 31 Oct 2016 02:57:17 PM UTC, comment #12:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/22/Kazakh_latin_alphabet_%281931%29.JPG suggests that the comma form was used in the Kazakh Arabic alphabet too. It is worth investigating whether there are any languages that actually prefer the dammah form.

David Corbett <dscorbett>
Mon 31 Oct 2016 01:16:05 PM UTC, comment #11:

I have seen that article again, and I found 1950s era typesetting seems has a large influence on modern Uyghur typesetting, making what I have seen in Xinjiang, also, I see another apecial form of hyphen for Uyghur, which looks like underscore, I can see it everywhere in Xinjiang.

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Mon 31 Oct 2016 01:07:10 PM UTC, comment #10:

OK Steve, Uyghur doesn’t uses damma form, when I go to Xinjiang, I see inverted comma form many times when I see Uyghur texts on their shop boards, none of them has damma form. I also see it on some Uyghur restaurants outside of Xinjiang, it seems to me all the native Uyghur fonts use an inverted comma instead of damma.

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Sun 30 Oct 2016 08:28:42 PM UTC, comment #9:

Hi Hsing-yen,

This is a nice page.

Most of the images are of modern writing with modern fonts. These are of less interest.

There is a 1912 image, but I don't see the character at all in it. Had the orthography changed?

One of the images is helpful, the one with a subtitle
圖:1957 年出版的圖書《心愿》(Köngül Arzusi)
In this, a diacritic appears that is in the direction of a comma, but still loooks somewhat lika a damma.

This inclines to more to think this may be a really distinct letter form. I would like to see more examples. I think the Unicode consortium would be, too.

Another interesting question is: does the damma form appear in any Uyghur typesetting? That is, is this a style that appears sometimes, or after a certain point in time, or has it for a long time been a special form used for that language?

In any case, this won't go into FreeFont for a while. I don't want to start with language-specific variants until the next release is out.

So, you have time!

Steve White <Stevan_White>
Project AdministratorIn charge of this item.
Sun 30 Oct 2016 04:26:34 PM UTC, comment #8:

Hello Steve,

I found a printing material recently in this article. http://www.typeisbeautiful.com/2016/02/9927/zh-hant/

In this article you can find an Uyghur book Köngül Arzusi which printed in 1957, and you will see it.

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Mon 24 Oct 2016 04:11:57 AM UTC, comment #7:

The 30th Internationalization and Unicode Conference also has an essay about Uyghur language, on this essay you can also find that

http://www.uyghurdictionary.org/excerpts/Waris_Abdukerim_Janbaz_IUC30.pdf

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Mon 24 Oct 2016 02:49:07 AM UTC, comment #6:

Hi Steve,

On ukij.org I found an another material on this form, on this document Uyghur ۇ looks sightly different from Middle East.

https://ug.wikipedia.org/wiki/%DA%BE%D8%A7%D8%B2%D9%89%D8%B1%D9%82%D9%89_%D8%B2%D8%A7%D9%85%D8%A7%D9%86_%D8%A6%DB%87%D9%8A%D8%BA%DB%87%D8%B1_%D9%8A%DB%90%D8%B2%D9%89%D9%82%D9%89

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Fri 21 Oct 2016 03:04:51 AM UTC, comment #5:

Hi Hsing-yen,

I don't doubt your story. Nonetheless, we need some documentary evidence.

An image of a book printed before computers, showing this form of the glyph, will be satisfactory. Modern web pages and fonts are insufficient for me -- I don't want to blindly follow a trend.

Steve White <Stevan_White>
Project AdministratorIn charge of this item.
Thu 20 Oct 2016 06:56:59 PM UTC, comment #4:

Yeah, I found that too. Since Uyghur alphabet become true alphabet, I think, ۇ is used very common in Uyghur and damma is simplified as comma shaped. And anyway, I think this variant should be intergrated to reflect their tradition.

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Mon 17 Oct 2016 08:21:46 PM UTC, comment #3:

This was just posted in bug 49570:
http://www.ukij.org/fonts/image/2004-1-17_Birlikke_Kelgen_Uyghurche_Herpler_Kod_Jedwili.gif
It shows the comma form.

Steve White <Stevan_White>
Project AdministratorIn charge of this item.
Mon 17 Oct 2016 01:59:49 AM UTC, comment #2:

Yes this form is really used in Uyghur, you can it everywhere when you go to Xinjiang, PR China. You can also find it on thier official website.

http://www.xinjiang.gov.cn/
http://uygur.xinjiang.gov.cn/

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>
Sun 16 Oct 2016 04:46:08 PM UTC, comment #1:

Hello Hsing-yen,

The letter in question is, as I understand it,
06C7 ARABIC LETTER U
In the Unicode Standard chart for Arabic, it appears as a waw with ia damma (U+064F) above. That sign has a hole in it -- it looks somewhat like a 9, not a comma.

So what are you saying?

That when used in Uyghur, the letter takes a different form? If so, please provide evidence of this.

Thanks!

Steve White <Stevan_White>
Project AdministratorIn charge of this item.
Sun 16 Oct 2016 04:20:30 PM UTC, original submission:

In the Uyghur word ئۇيغۇر, the letter ۇ looks incrrect in Uyghur, its diacrict should looks like comma shaped, not 9 shaped. cf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Uyghurche.png

Hsing-yen He <hammerandsickle>

 

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